00:00:00April 26, 2023
Transcript
Suzy Karasik: Good morning. My name is Suzy Karasik. Today is November 4th and I
am interviewing Carol Graham, Master Gardener, native Californian, and so much
that we will learn here in part of the North County Oral History Initiative.
Carol, thank you for joining me today. (coughs)
Carol Graham: (nods) My pleasure.
Karasik: And, um, I wanted to just say briefly how I met Carol. I’m part of the
EcoFest that we had here in Encinitas a couple of weeks ago. It’s an annual
event that we do to educate people to everything involved with the ecology and
the environment here in the county. And Carol had an incredible display (Carol
gestures with her arms to display the posterboards on a table behind her) with
the Master Gardeners, which we’ve been able to set up here and hopefully make it
a little bit more readable. (Carol holds up a model of a fly, with a paper flyer
attached and hanging below it) And
00:01:00Carol, let’s just start here. As we had discussed, let’s talk a little bit about
where you born and your childhood and if any of that happened to prepare you for
what was to come in your most interesting life and, um, how you’ve identified
yourself over the years and your relationship with the county. So, you can start there.
Graham: Well, I was born in North Claremont, the city of San Diego. And my
mother was a very avid fruit tree gardener. And I really benefited because when
my husband and I moved up here to Encinitas over forty years ago, it’s a similar
microclimate to the one I grew up in, which means the fruit trees that I
enjoyed--gardening at my mother’s knees, and fell in love with certain varieties
of nectarines and other delicious fruits, loquats--I could grow those same
varieties here
00:02:00which was nice.
Karasik: Yes.
Graham: And it was a very pleasant community to grow up in.
Karasik: If I may ask, if you don’t mind, what year were you born, or--
Graham: Oh. (chuckles) 1952.
Karasik: Okay.
Graham: Yes. So, I just recently celebrated--not that many months ago--my 70th birthday.
Karasik: Yes! So, tell us a little bit about your school and what it was like
here in the North County--well, you were actually down in San Diego--
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: --as you were growing up.
Graham: I went to elementary school and junior high in the city of San Diego.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Now, my father was a career Marine. So, we had three years in Virginia,
and I graduated from high school in Virginia.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And then we came back to San Diego because the house had been
rented--not sold. So, we were able to come back to the same garden, the same
microclimate, which was great for the garden--
00:03:00
Karasik: Yes.
Graham: --the same fruit trees waiting for us--
Karasik: Yes.
Graham: --the ones that we had planted earlier. So, it was a very pleasant
experience, very supportive of the interests that I continue to enjoy today.
Karasik: So–so you graduated from high school in–in–out east, and--
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: --then you came back out here. What were your–What was your initial
work, and--
Graham: Well, I went to S.D.S.U. and earned a bachelor’s degree in Zoology--
Karasik: Mmm.
Graham: --because animals have always fascinated me, and that’s not just the
animals many people first think of are the gigantic giraffe and interesting
hippopotamus, and rhinoceros. But I’m also fascinated by what some people will
refer to as the–the bugs (holds up a stuffed toy puppet ladybug, and chuckles).
So, um--
Karasik: Let’s talk about the bugs a little bit.
Graham: Yeah. Well, I am very pleased to educate people on--well, most people
recognize this as one of their favorite bugs in the whole garden, the lady
beetle. (has now put on the puppet on her right hand and is holding it up in
front of her) People call it the ladybug, but it’s more scientific to call
00:04:00it the lady beetle. Because actually the word “bug” has a derogatory reference.
It comes from old English, meaning something unpleasant (makes a face, and
gestures with her left hand to indicate something scattering away). So, lady
beetle is the more appropriate, better name. And it’s interesting in that its
larval stage looks creepy! (holds up another stuffed animal, which appears to be
a larval stage representation of the lady beetle). So--
Karasik: I did not know that!
Graham: --the larval stage, as I tell people, “Yes, it looks like a creepy,
six-legged, micro alligator.” So, it’s very important that we reach out to the
public, as Master Gardeners, and inform people “when you see this in the garden,
don’t assume it’s something bad.” (she shakes the larval-stage, stuffed animal)
For instance, (turns to her right and looks at the posterboard behind her, first
to one with the header “IPM” then points to the board with the header
“Identify”) one of the first steps of Integrated Pest Manager—which is what
I.P.M. stands for—is identify friend or foe. Because if you assume this is bad
(holds up the larval stage stuffed toy) and as many people have told me as they
come by our Master Gardener exhibit, they had no idea it was a lady beetle
larva. They thought it was something bad ‘cuz it looks creepy! You know what
they had told me they had done? They sprayed it with pesticide, or they squished
it, or they taught their kids to be afraid of it, which was so sad. Especially
00:05:00since this (shakes the larval stage toy) can not do any good if you squish it!
(laughs) Um, but I admit, yes, it looks creepy. And we also educate people that
not all lady beetles look like this. (Shakes her right hand which has the mature
lady beetle puppet on it) Not all of them are red.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: So, we have an assortment of photos that show different colors for the
different species ‘cuz it–it’s great to benefit not from just one species of
lady beetle (again shakes her puppeted right hand) but several. (Turns to put
both of those stuffed toys down on the bench next to her, then holds up a
stuffed toy that looks like a mosquito, which has a paper flyer hanging off of
it.). And on the dark side, we also need to educate people about this character.
Karasik: Ugh.
Graham: Now, a Master Gardener friend of mine made both this educational model
(again holds up the larval stage toy) and this (holds up mosquito toy). And she
made them too pretty, in a way, because this looks, actually, quite attractive.
And it is the creepy mosquito! And I think we’ve all been bitten by mosquitoes.
And some people don’t realize but the mosquito actually has been given the
horrific title of the most deadly animal we share the planet with, because the
part it plays vectoring malaria,
00:06:00dengue, yellow fever. Even West Nile virus killed some of our residents here in
San Diego County. It was about fifteen, seventeen years ago.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Now, it’s true that apparently everyone who died of West Nile virus in
our county had pre-existing medical conditions or they would have survived. But
it’s also true some of those people could be alive today if they hadn’t been
bitten by infected mosquitoes. But unfortunately, 3the mosquito larvae are not
easily identifiable for people who haven’t been introduced to them. And many of
our neighbors are growing mosquito larvae in their bird baths and other
water-containing items, children’s toys, and buckets in the garden. Stagnant
water is where the mother mosquito likes to lay her eggs. In a few days, those
eggs hatch out to larvae. And when I have displayed larvae—‘cuz sometimes I’ll
deliberately grow them to have them on exhibit, and I take the lid off the jar
only after I make sure they’re just in the larval stage. No adults to fly out
and bite people.
00:07:00And I will ask people as they come to the exhibit, “Do you know what this is?”
and over half the adults have no idea it’s mosquito larvae, which is very
disturbing, because they’re growing them possibly in their gardens. And when
they see them, they’re not motivated to dump it out, ‘cuz they don’t know what
it is.
Karasik: This is so important, and so, uh, (Graham puts down the mosquito toy)
so–so much of it is actually unknown to the public. I’m curious, if you wanted
to just kind of go through these four stages, if you will. (Carol stands up and
turns toward posterboards) And then we’ll talk more about how you even became to
be a Master Gardener. But I don’t want to—
Graham: Okay.
Karasik: --uh, (Carol sits back down again) forget to look at a little bit more
of your early days--
Granham: Okay.
Karasik: --so we’ll come back.
Graham: (she turns toward the board that reads “IPM.”) Well, the first stage in
Integrated Pest Management, as I said, is Identify--(points to the posterboard
reading “Identify”) friends, and admittedly some of these friends do look
creepy--(points to photographs under the subheading “Friends” on that posterboard)
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: --and foes. (points to, and circles with her right-hand finger, various
photographs under the subheading “Foes”). And here, kind of the star of the
show, (circles the middle of the board, which has a collage of photos) indeed,
we recognize the adult lady beetle
00:08:00(points to the photo of the lady beetle). I hardly ever see the eggs (points to
a photo of lady beetle eggs) and I have my head in the garden a lot, so I’m
surprised I don’t see them more often. But, at certain times of the year, I’ll
see the larval stage, (points to a photo of a larval lady beetle) and as I said,
I’ll admit it looks creepy like a six-legged micro alligator. And the pupal
stage (points to a photo of a pupa of a lady beetle). And if, ideally, people
would get this in high school or junior high school biology, it would be so
helpful for the public health of our communities. And then of course you move on
(stands up and points to the posterboard with the subheading “Understand”) to
understand relationships, like the sooty mold, which is this black powdery
(points to a photo of leaves with black mold on it) material you frequently find
on some infected leaves (reads the text above the photos, indicating it with her
left hand)—“grows on the honeydew, produced by sucking insects.” So,
unfortunately, it’s not uncommon to have aphids or mealybugs or whiteflies or
scale. And what goes in one end to their body as food—‘cuz they puncture the
tender leaves and they’re sucking the sap—comes out the other end of their body,
and instead of calling it like “aphid poop” it's called “honeydew.”
Karasik: (chuckles)
Graham: And this honeydew
00:09:00is a rich source of food for the growth, unfortunately, of ants which will
protect these bad guys and sooty mold to grow. And here (points to a photo of
ants) we see the ants will actually chase away the good guys who would eat some
of these bad guys. But the ants are kind of protecting the bad guys because
they’re eating--
Karasik: That’s their sustenance.
Graham: --the honeydew. Yeah. It’s kind of like we--
Karasik: Yeah.
Graham: --protect our dairy cattle from predators who might eat them, because we
want to milk them and benefit from them.
Karasik: Right, right.
Graham: (then points to the text toward the bottom with her left hand) And
understanding leads to multiple control approaches--biological, cultural,
chemical, physical. There’s quite a diversity there. (She then moves toward the
posterboard with the subheading “Assess,” points to the text with her left hand,
and reads) And assess. Butterflies and moths are pollinators. Butterfly and moth
larvae are consumers. Well, some bugs, I say they’re like children. They don’t
always behave. They do some good and some bad (chuckles). And you have to kind
of evaluate how it interacts in your garden.
00:10:00(points directly to the camera and whispers “The screen went dark. Is that a
problem? Appears to wait for answer, and then says “okay,” and continues) You
have to assess how they interact (using her left hand, she circles above a
diagram showing the cycle of interaction of insects) in your garden, whether the
bit of bad they do is less than the good they do. So, you can label them a good
or a bad. Um, and of course, the green fruit beetle (points to the bottom of the
board, to a photo of a beetle). Well, some people label it a pest, because it
will attack, damage overripe soft fruits--peach, nectarines, plums,
apricot--'cuz it’s drawn to the fragrance. But, the grub, which admittedly looks
creepy, is a fantastic decomposer. And it’s in all our compost piles, helping
break things down. And it has a strict diet of eating rotting organic matter
only. Although, it does look similar to the June Beetle grubs which eat live
plant roots and tubers and corms. So, I try and teach people how to tell the difference--
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: (then moves toward the posterboard with the subheading “Control” and
points to a pyramid illustration) --and then the control aspects, from cultural
which is considered benign approach; mechanical and physical--I mean, just
physically pulling (with her left hand, mimics pulling off the insects from the
photos on the “Assess” posterboard) the snails off your plants;
00:11:00biological--reloos–reducing–releasing--excuse me--lady beetles, or recognizing
the lady beetle larvae that you do have so you don’t accidentally spray it with
pesticide; to chemical (points to the top of the pyramid on “Control”
posterboard). And all these different approaches are out there (waves her left
hand above the pyramid) and they should be assessed and see how they fit into
your garden. So, I think that (waves her left hand in front of all four
posterboards, indicating totality) kind of reviews them all.
Karasik: Pretty much covers that. Before we go back to your childhood, I’m going
to pause here just for a minute (Graham sits back down and nods)
Karasik: Okay, Carol. I think probably one of the most important aspects of this
beautiful background that you chose to bring is the chemical aspect of the pest
management. (Carol points to the pyramid on the “Control” posterboard) So, let’s
talk a little bit about that and the toxicity because I’m thinking that our
descendants that may be watching this oral history in the years to come will
know a whole lot–a lot more about what would have been a more wise pest
management than we do now.
00:12:00
Graham: (again pointing at the posterboard) Well, the chemical aspect is
considered the most toxic, and we want you to try the cultural, physical, and
biological approaches first. And under the chemical (reads the text on the
posterboard, which I’ve designated in quotations) “Use only in combination with
the other controls.” It’s not like you have to use only these or only the
chemical. You can use them together. And hopefully you won’t even have to go to
the chemicals. Hopefully, you can control it by the other approaches. “Use a
pest–pest specific non-broad-spectrum pesticide.” In other words, if you do feel
you have to use a chemical pesticide, don’t spray the whole garden, and make
sure that before you buy any pesticide you carefully read the container and that
it mentions the specific pest you’re trying to address, ‘cuz there are
pesticides out there that would be totally wasted if you bought this pesticide
and it didn’t apply to this pest that you were trying to control.
Karasik: Right.
Graham: And yet you introduce something toxic into the environment
unnecessarily--very undesirable, of course.
00:13:00“Select the least toxic pesticide to reduce potential risks. Always read and
follow directions on the pesticide label. It’s the law.” And as I tell people,
well, the first thing you read before you buy any pesticide is will it address
your target, you also want to make sure is it okay to put on the plant you want
to put it on, ‘cuz many of us are growing edibles, and some of the pesticides
like insecticidal soap are okay to put on edibles--fruits and vegetables--and
will mention that on the paper. Whereas there are other pesticides that you
definitely wouldn’t want to put on your edibles, ‘cuz they can get soaked into
the plant, and you wouldn’t want to be eating them when you’re eating the
produce from that plant.
Karasik: Right. I–I was curious if you feel that very many people are actually
aware, for example, of the dangers of glyphosate and how that has pretty much
penetrated the entire planet.
00:14:00And I’m wondering in the future, um, you know, what will–what will become of
that. Do you try to educate specifically on that or does that bother you that
it’s still sold and advertised and is just so deadly?
Graham: Well, mostly, we’re not targeting any one pesticide. We want people to
open their minds to p–basically trying chemical, physical, and biological
approaches before they’d even consider the pesticide. So, we spend most of our
time--if we can teach them about biological control, physical control, or
cultural control, hopefully they’ll never even have to get to the point where
they’re considering a chemical pesticide.
Karasik: Right. Right. And when you–you go into schools and tell me a little bit
about who–who all is your audience. Obviously, festivals like we had--
Graham: Oh, the Encinitas EcoFest was very nice--
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: --attended. And, of course, we do have many Master Gardeners
00:15:00helping in school gardens. And of course, when you’re talking to the students
and their supervisors--the teachers, the staff, chaperones, and parents--about
how to properly grow this product that they’re going to pick from the garden and
eat, you definitely want to mention that “okay, we’re not going to put this
pesticide on here because we don’t have any pests on this. Isn’t it great?” That
kind of thing.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Or “oh, we do have pests. We have snails, sliming up the trunk of our
citrus tree.” But instead of using a pesticide, we can teach them, of course,
much simpler approach, just pick it off.
Karasik: How–huh–who knew!
Graham: Or we can use a copper band, because snails don’t actually like to slime
over copper. It tastes bad for them. So, if we teach them that, we are hopefully
enlightening them so when they actually grow to adulthood and have their own
yards and their own gardens, they will not first grab the chemical control approach.
Karasik: Oh, uh, that’s really great.
00:16:00Well, let’s talk a little bit about, I think maybe, how your life tha–developed,
how you met your husband.
Graham: Okay.
Karasik: And, um, let’s–let’s hear about that.
Graham: Well, I was attending San Diego State University, working on my Bachelor
of Science in Zoology degree, and my husband, actually, had graduated from there
and he was the teaching aide for the lab class in one of the biology classes.
So, that’s how I met him, which is interesting. He was in marine biology which
was kind of far away from my backyard biology, but still a biologist. And within
a year of completing my degree, we were both working at Saturn Oak–San Onofre
Nuclear Generating Station Plant One, in that the Nuclear Generating Station
would shut down, I believe it was like every eight weeks,
00:17:00and they would heat-treat and chemical-treat the water intake system, because
they had a large pipe--I think it was, like, twelve-foot diameter or
something--and it was sucking in ocean water which was cooling some of the rest
of the system at the nuclear power plant. But you’re sucking in water from the
ocean, so you’re sucking in barnacles and polychaetas and other biophaline. They
settle on the pipe and they grow. And this of course not only reduces the
diameter of the water intake flow, but also when you’re treating, you might end
up with some of these clogs of biophaline getting sucked in and causing
problems. So, every, I think it was eight weeks, but don’t quote me on that, I
think they were shutting the plant down to chemically treat and heat treat to
kill the biophaline so it didn’t keep growing. Unfortunately, every time they
shut the plant down, I believe I was told it was $10,000 more an hour
00:18:00for the energy company to buy energy to supply us than it was making the energy
at San Onofre. And people really didn’t relate to this because they’d flip the
lights on and the switch would come on because the power company was being
responsible and making sure the power was there, even though it was costing
more. But people were, of course, ending up having to pay a bit more, because it
was more expensive when it was shut down. Now, as a biologist, it seemed pretty
obvious that in the cold of the winter, the biophaline wasn’t growing as fast.
And why were we shutting down the power plant every eight weeks, year-round,
regardless of the time of the year. So, on site, I like to joke, I was basically
locked into this research trailer, and I was measuring the biophaline on these
research plates, so identifying which quadrat on which plate, and what was the
diameter of that barnacle,
00:19:00and this polychaete, and that barnacle. And we measured them, for a year, and we
were able to show people the hard scientific evidence that things were growing
slower in the cold winter waters. And they didn’t have to shut the plant down as
often. So, in the end, after we generated–processed all the data, etc., indeed
they considered this quite a successful study. So, they weren’t shutting the
plant down every week–eight weeks in the winter, because they realized things
weren’t growing as fast, as far as the biophaline. So, everybody in the long run
saved money, even the cost of the research, which seemed quite expensive at the
time although now that the quanti–the money for that research project doesn’t
seem quite as expensive as it was decades ago. But they more than saved, because
of the change they could do in running the plant.
Karasik: I’m curious, too, because you didn’t have computers back then. Or did
you have s--
Graham: It was much slower.
Karasik: Yeah. You did have some large, like,
00:20:00big equipment that did do some processing.
Graham: I’ve talked about after the year of being locked into the research
trailer on site of San Onofre, I was locked for a year (chuckles) into the
office to transfer the data. Whereas, if we’d had more sophisticated computers
back then, it would have been much faster.
Karasik: Right. Now, where was your husband working at the–at San Onofre.
Graham: Well, he was the lead investigator, so we were locked into the same trailer.
Karasik: Oh, that was nice! (chuckles)
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: I’m curi--
Graham: There were three of us in the trailer.
Karasik: Right. I’m curious, too, because I think it’s important from a–a
women’s perspective. Did you feel any sense of a gender discrimination, or were
women respected?
Graham: No. I was given full respect.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Um, because it didn’t matter what my gender was. I was still going to be
locked into that research trailer. ‘Cuz it’s–it was San Onofre Nuclear
Generating Station. So, basically, you went to the main entrance. You were
00:21:00evaluated, basically. They also threw the dice and every three or four or six
people would be body-searched, (chuckles) physically patted down--
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: --going in. And this was before we really thought of terrorist
activities much. And then we had to walk directly to the research trailer. And
even at lunch we didn’t leave the research trailer. We would bring our lunches
in and stay in that trailer until the end of the day, research day.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And we walked right out. But I never felt--
Karasik: And was your pay equal?
Graham: Yes. Mm-hmm.
Karasik: Oh, that’s--I’m really happy to hear that.
Graham: I mean, not necessarily equal to my husband, because he was the lead investigator.
Karasik: Correct.
Graham: But equal to the other party, who happened to be a guy, in the research
trailer doing the same work I was doing.
Karasik: Mm-hmm. Well, I’m glad to hear that. And it must have also really been
nice to work with your husband and be able to share your knowledge and
excitement about the job. That must have been–been really great.
00:22:00
Graham: Well, he was a marine biologist, so he was quite into it.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Now, I wasn’t as into the organisms, because I was more terrestrial
biologist, of course.
Karasik: Right.
Graham: Backyard gardening, etc.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: But I did appreciate the fact that this was a–basically a clean form of
energy, compared to burning coal.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And, um--
Karasik: And how do you feel about that now? Not that we have to go into a huge
nuclear discussion.
Graham: Well, now it’s shut down.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And of course, the–the complication is dealing with the remnants, the
radioactive remnants.
Karasik: Yes.
Graham: And I’d like to see the country go more and more into clean energy--but
nuclear was considered clean--
Karasik: Right.
Graham: --and weed ourself away from the energy sources that are not considered
good for the environment.
Karasik: You know, that reminds me. At the EcoFest, there was another booth that
passed out quite a bit of information about the San Onofre situation and what we
need to know as far as how close
00:23:00some of those storage tanks are to water sources and other things like that. Do
you--is that a concern for you at all? Or do you think the public is aware of that?
Graham: I think they’re doing a good job dealing with that. I would eventually
like to see that material moved. For decades now, they’ve talked about moving it
to a--I’ve forgotten the exact location.
Karasik: There’s a place in Nevada, I know.
Graham: Yeah. I don’t know exactly where in Nevada, but--
Karasik: And then, of course, there’s the NIMBY--Not In My Backyard.
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: And then the people in Nevada were like “Well, you know, we don’t want
it here.” So, I think this is an interesting discussion that in decades to come
when people come back and look at this and will see what–what’s been done that’s
much more safe, and–and won’t that–won’t that be great, hopefully.
Graham: But, I’m sure glad we weren’t burning more--
Karasik: Yes.
Graham: --coal at the time to generate that energy--
Karasik: Exactly.
Graham: --when we were using.
Karasik: And that–and that’s still an issue. So,
00:24:00then, tell me a little bit about either how San Onofre ended. You had a–a–I know
you have one son that you had mentioned to me. So, tell me a little bit about
your family and tell me about your–your parents and your husband’s parents, and
where they came from and, you know, how your lives developed here in North County.
Graham: Oh. Well, my husband and I moved to Encinitas over forty years ago. And,
because it was relatively close to where the Lockheed Marine Biology Research
facility was, where I was staying in the office for a year and processing the
data from San Onofre. And my parents still lived in San Diego and my in-laws
also lived in San Diego. So, it was smart to live on the Encinitas, south of
where we went to work, because that was closer to go and visit them, which we
frequently did. And my son—the
00:25:00family joke is “What does the only child of two biologists go into study-wise
and stay in science, but get as far away philosophically and geographically from
any of the biological studies as possible?” Astrophysics! (chuckles) So he got
his–actually, his PhD finally. He started with his bachelor’s at Berkeley, and
then wan–went to on get his Ph.D. at a–a--what is that, in Maryland, the institution--
Karasik: In Annapolis, or?--
Graham: People think first of the medical aspect.
Karasik: Right. Mm, we’ll come back to that.
Graham: He’s going to criticize me for not remembering where he got his PhD.
Karasik: Mmm.
Graham: Anyway. And he had some research in astrophysics.
Karasik: Not John Hopkins? [sic]
Graham: John Hopkins, [sic] yes. I’m sorry.
Karasik: Johns Hopkins. Okay, great.
Graham: I’m going to have to apologize for a minute, not remembering, John
Hopkins. [sic]
Karasik: That’s alright. Yeah.
Graham: He got his PhD at John Hopkins. [sic] Yes.
Karasik: Yes. Prestigious. Yes.
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: So, you had just the one son?
Graham: Just the one son.
Karasik: Okay. So, tell me a little bit about where your parents came from,
00:26:00um, you know, what generation you are. Did they come directly to California? Do
you know? ‘Cuz a lot of us don’t really know where our ancestors came from,
other than immediate. How much do you know about both yours and your husband’s?
Graham: Okay, my mother was born in Minneapolis, Minnesota. My father was born
in Ohio. Now, I believe, possibly, the previous generation had come from Ireland
and England and Germany. My in-laws, my mother-in-law was born in, I think,
Kansas City, Missouri, which is, you know, Kansas City but it’s in Missouri, but
I guess it’s a city that’s--
Karasik: They’re sister cities on the border.
Graham: Yes. Right across the river from each other.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And my father-in-law was born in Kirkcaldy, Scotland.
Karasik: Mmm! So he immigrated here and--
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: --with his wife?
00:27:00Do you know?
Graham: No.
Karasik: Or did he meet her here?
Graham: He married her here.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: And then I guess they all decided to come out to California? Do you
know anything about that journey?
Graham: Um, my father-in-law was working, I believe, in the aircraft industry,
which was quite active at one time in San Diego.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Manufacturing. And my father was a career Marine, and was stationed out
here at Camp Pendleton and--
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: --some other facilities in southern California.
Karasik: There’s a lot of history from Camp Pendleton that will be in our Oral History.
Graham: Oh! Good.
Karasik: Yeah. So, I guess probably, let’s switch then a little bit. When we
look at your life’s work, uh, did–did you want to say more about after you
didn’t work for San Onofre anymore, did you get more involved tha--How did you
get involved with the Master Gardeners? Let’s go there.
Graham: Oh, well, um, we had my son.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And my neighbors
00:28:00warned me that, “If you’re looking for infant childcare, you can’t depend on the
local teenagers, if you want to do a routine.” And I wanted to apply to Master
Gardeners, which was going to be, I think, seventeen consecutive Tuesdays, and
you were expected to attend every one, ideally. And I was wondering, “Okay.” So
I asked my mother, “I would like to go through this Master Gardener program
which is put on through the University of California Cooperative Extension and
become a Master Gardener volunteer, which is dedicated to disseminating
information for a successful and environmentally responsible home gardening. But
your infant grandson would need care every Tuesday for like seventeen
consecutive Tuesdays.” And she said yes. So, I’m very beholden to my mother because--
Karasik: Thank you, mother!
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: Yes.
Graham: Because otherwise I’m not sure where I could have dropped him off for just--
Karasik: Right. And what year would that have been?
Graham: He was born in 1982.
00:29:00
Karasik: Mmm, so you had--
Graham: Then it was in 1983 that I started the Master Gardener program.
Karasik: Oh. Wonderful.
Graham: He was just a year old.
Karasik: Okay. So, how would you say that work has changed over the years for
you, and just tell me more about--I–I–I think, in these interviews we want
genera–future generations that come back and watch this and want to learn about
the community and how the peoples lives were affected (Carol points to something
off camera), what you’d--(Carol looks again off camera and starts to chuckle)
what you would want them to know.
Graham: Well, Encinitas is a great community to live in. The microclimate is
fantastic for people who like to grow a diversity of fruit. Although before you
grow any fruit trees, no matter where you’re living, always check that the
microclimate is adapted. I frequently, at the Master Gardener exhibit, drag out
the Sunset Western Garden book
00:30:00and ask people, “Do you have this?” And if you don’t, you can check it out at
any good library and tell them that this book divides the western portion of the
United States into twenty-four different micro zones. And I open the map and we
can usually identify where they’re living, and at least before they go away, I
can tell them, “Oh, you open up Sunset Garden book, and you want to look at what
apple varieties grow in your microclimate, look for this number on the
microclimate.” Because, unfortunately, as a Master Gardener I’ve had people tell
me they have purchased certain fruit trees, certain varieties, and I ask, “Oh,
where are you gardening?” And I have to tell them, “That variety is not adapted
to your microclimate. It’s not going to thrive.” And I even had a personal
situation. Years ago, there was a new variety of--I’ve forgotten whether it was,
um, a peach or a nectarine--and it came out--it was supposed to be okay for zone
24, close to the coast in southern California.
00:31:00And the next year, after I’d bought it that year, the next year they said
“Sorry. We made a mistake. It’s further inland that it’s adapted to.” So, I dug
up the tree, had a fellow Master Gardener who lived further inland and said
“Would you like this tree? Because I bought this under the belief that it was
going to thrive, and now they’ve changed what they’ve recommended.”
Karasik: Right.
Graham: So, it is critical to do your research first to be successful in
gardening. And we don’t want you wasting water, putting water on varieties of
plants that are not adapted to your microclimate, whether it’s fruit trees or
just ornamentals.
Karasik: That is so important. So--
Graham: Especially with water being super critical now.
Karasik: Absolutely, which will be another interesting aspect to look at when
future generations, uh—what that’s going to be like. Do you--So, was your
husband involved in the Master Gardeners too? Or then did you--you didn’t work,
uh, when you had your son.
Graham: Right.
Karasik: And then what–what
00:32:00did he do? (Carol looks puzzled at the question) What was his work? Did he st--
Graham: My–my husband’s work?
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Well, he continued to work for the Lockheed Marine Biological Research.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Um, now he wasn’t involved directly in Master Gardeners, but I must say
that, uh, there were frequently times when I would have a long day at a Master
Gardener exhibit, um, like you experienced at the Encinitas EcoFest recently,
and I’d be driving home and very often he had the garage door open for me, ‘cuz
I had told him when I went off, I hoped to be back in this time period, and the
garage door was opened. I could drive right in. And he was a great cook, so it
was wonderful because there was dinner waiting for me all ready and he really
spoiled me. (chuckles) So--
Karasik: That’s so wonderful.
Graham: --not directly in Master Gardeners but he did support me to a high
degree in Master Gardener.
Karasik: Yeah. Behind ever--huh--there’s a saying: “Behind every great man is an
exhausted woman.” (both she and Carol chuckle)
Graham: Right.
Karasik: And so I think we could probably--
Graham: (nodding her head) Yes.
Karasik: --turn that around. Um, what would you say
00:33:00some–are some of your greatest accompish–accomplishments in your life?
Graham: Well, reaching out to so many people at Master Gardeners has made me
really feel good in that, as I say, I want people, ideally, to have at least a
little bit of a–an edible garden. So when their kids come around and the kids
have the opportunity as young gardeners to pick that lovely tomato or bell
pepper (gestures as if picking something with her right hand) or maybe it’s a
fruit--a peach or nectarine--and eat it and say, “Mmm, really good,” that they
directly understand where their food comes from.
Karasik: (whispers) Yes.
Graham: Because, while some of our food comes from the ocean and the rivers and
the lakes, so much of it comes from the good earth. And children who grow up
picking the stuff from their garden, I think, are going to realize that and
makes a connection and be far less apt to pollute or litter. ‘Cuz they
understand why would you want to put pollution or litter
00:34:00on the ground. That’s where your food comes from!
Karasik: Exactly. Do you feel like you’ve been successful in educating hopefully
thousands of people, because there is a lot of concern now about our food
sources? And I myself just recently got a tower garden because I want to be able
to grow my own food and it seems like we might be moving more to that. Um, you
know, I don’t know if we want to get into it, but we may just want to mention
because of the--being a–a–an oral history, you know, monocropping and how all
the large corporations have taken over the farming. And so is this--Do you feel
like you’ve had a little place in there where you’ve been able to--
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: --educate.
Graham: And also sharing with people the experience. Well, there are some
peaches and nectarines I’ve enjoyed purchasing in the market, but none of them
have the
00:35:00fantastic flavor that my mother and I used to grow and the Panamint
nectarine--that’s the one we really adore. And some people love the Babcock
peach, but that’s sweet-on-sweet. And my personal taste buds like the sweet with
tang, which the Panamint lives up to. So, you can customize better your
favorites by growing them. And of course, the macadamia! Well, the macadamia
nut--what is that—$12.99 to $19.99 a pound for the nuts in the market when you
buy them. Well, you can grow them yourself. They’re easy to grow, although heads
up! (points her left pointer finger into the air). I want to alert everybody.
They are really a lot of work to crack, even if you buy the specific macadamia
cracker which I bought. But so I try to educate people as to this and--
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: ‘Cuz the macadamia tree was my husband’s, um--I don’t know if it was his
birthday, or his Christmas present the first year after we moved in. He wanted a macadamia.
Karasik: Nice. Well, I’m definitely going to be coming to you,
00:36:00because even me being over in the far east side of North County, that is going
to be different. And I’m very excited to learn more about what you think would
be best for me to plant, primarily just for me to consume.
Graham: Mm-hmm. Good.
Karasik: That’s my--And also, did you want to talk a little bit about all the
different flowers that are edibles that people don’t know about, different
fl–like nasturtians [sic], for example.
Graham: I’m really not educated on that aspect. My mother wasn’t into edible
flowers, and I haven’t gone into it because I’ve been so enamored of the–the
fruits, mais–mostly tree fruits.
Karasik: Sure, yeah. Pe--
Graham: And–and thornless blackberries!
Karasik: Oh!
Graham: Yes, ‘cuz I grew up with the Olallie blackberry which mother had which
was delicious but boy does that have thorns! (holds up both her hands, fingers
spread wide to emphasize prickliness of thorns)
Karasik: Really!
Graham: Decades of research and now we have thornless varieties out there.
Karasik: Oh, I didn’t know that!
Graham: So, yes. Triple crown.
Karasik: It’ll–it’ll be really interesting for botanists, for example, who might
be–get to hear these–this interview,
00:37:00in particular, and see how things have changed. I mean, there is certainly the
concern that California may become a desert. And we do definitely have water
issues right now. Does that, uh, take up some of your time of concern?
Graham: It is concerning. However, I tell people, “Well, um, hopefully when we
get off this third year of really severe drought here in San Diego County and
people actually start to feel they can put plants in the ground again, well,
instead of putting ornamentals, why not put some edibles? Wouldn’t that be a
better use of the water?” And as I said you can also customize, so you can put
your–your edible in the variety that you couldn’t even find in the market.
Karasik: Right. Like sunchokes, Jerusalem artichokes. Those are hard to find,
and very nutritious--
Graham: Yeah.
Karasik: --for example. Well, we could certainly talk about gardening (both
Graham and Karasik chuckle). And that’s–and that
00:38:00was a lot of my reason for wanting to interview you, because I think this will
be very interesting to, um, our descendants. I guess, uh, if there’s anymore
that you’d like to tell about what you–what like what changes you would like to
see for future generations, and if you had a chance to talk to some of these
future generations, not just around Master Gardening but just about life in
general and what you’ve learned over the years, what–what you think is most
important that, uh--
Graham: Well, continuing on some of the issues that we mentioned--less lawn, and
more drought tolerant or edibles. Um, now there are some people who have a
legitimate desire to have a lawn. They have young kids who do want to play on
it. But that doesn’t mean they have to have a lawn both front and the back. And,
um, after a certain length of time, maybe they want to take the lawn out because
their kids are no longer playing
00:39:00on it--
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And cracking open the reference books, even good old Sunset Western
Garden book. And it has a plant finder section. And one of the things that it
addresses there are low water use plants.
Karasik: Drought tolerant.
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: Yes.
Graham: As well as delving through the various edibles--
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: --making sure you select the right variety for your microclimate, so
you’re successful and don’t waste water on a variety that was doomed from the start.
Karasik: Yeah. Hmm, well, we’ve just covered that so well. I think, more
than--it sounds like you’ve had a wonderful life and, of course, everything’s
not perfect. There is a question here. What are your regrets? Or what would you
do over if you could. Did you want to speak to that by chance? Or--
Graham: Well, I regret my husband passed away. My husband died.
Karasik: Yes. If you want to--
Graham: And I didn’t appreciate enough all the great cooking
00:40:00he used to do. Um, so now I’m spending a whole lot more time from going to the
grocery store and buying the food and prepping the food and thinking ahead,
“Okay, I have this many drumsticks. Am I going to eat chicken this many nights,
or am I going to eat some of this, and what’s in the freezer, and how much time
it takes.” ‘Cuz I’ve a terribly neglected yard. But I am enjoying the social
aspect of going out for Master Gardener exhibits.
Karasik: Yes.
Graham: Especially since my husband is gone now.
Karasik: Right.
Graham: So--
Karasik: And it hasn’t been that long, so--I know that, um, my condolences and I
know how that is. We–we all have to accept that part of life. And--
Graham: Mm-hmm. I’m grateful that he did have a good quality of life up until
the very end.
Karasik: Yes. And I think, too, that again that’s a lot why this oral history
project is so important. Because we don’t realize what interesting lives people
have had. And it doesn’t get documented. So, we certainly have
00:41:00more time. Um, here’s a couple of questions here around community that
might–might be interesting. It says “In what w–ways is your neighborhood special
or has it been unique or what are some of the favorite places in your community,
and how has–how has this area changed since you moved here? And that’s--
Graham: Yeah.
Karasik: --a big one.
Graham: When my husband and I first moved here, we didn’t even buy groceries in
Encinitas because there were very few grocery stores, you know. This was over
forty-five years ago. And there was a grocery store we’d go right past when we
were leaving that place of work. So, it made more sense to stop there, but it
wasn’t in Encinitas. And of course, I like to spend my consumer dollars in my
own community. And now we have over ten grocery stores!! I mean, in an
hour--excuse me, in a mile and a half, I can walk to four different grocery
stores in my community. And frequently I am walking because it’s checking
00:42:00off my exercise for the day and checking off my eco-point for the day, ‘cuz I’m
not driving my vehicle, um, and I enjoy it! And Encinitas allows me to do this
because of all the grocery stores they have, which forty-five years ago--
Karasik: And they’re some of the finest–some of the finest grocery stores.
Graham: Nice diversity.
Karasik: Not the least expensive, by any means, but definitely some of the
highest quality and the largest diversity of what is offered.
Graham: Yes. And we have farmer’s markets.
Karasik: We do.
Graham: Two of them in Encinitas.
Karasik: Yeah. Let’s talk–let’s talk a little bit about those. Do you get to
know any of those farmers? Or--
Graham: I actually--way back when, was it Harry Stone? Don’t quote me--who
founded the first farmer’s market in San Diego County up in Vista. He was a
member of the California Rare Fruit Growers. And I’ve been an avid member of the
California Rare Fruit Growers for decades. And the idea took off and it was great.
Karasik: You know, another interview that I did,
00:43:00I learned that the–there is a big difference, obviously, between an egg farm, a
truck farm, and a—are you familiar with that? So, the truck farm is the
vegetables that you would then truck to the market. And then obviously the egg
farm and the chickens, because Cal State San Marcos that was a huge egg farm.
And actually, on the way over here you were telling me there was a wonderful
nursery here that has now been--
Graham: Sunshine Gardens Nursery is now closed, and it was a very nice nursery
for I don’t know how many decades here.
Karasik: Mm-hmm. And now it’s–it’s–they’re making room for housing because we
need that, and–and I think all the more reason. We have community gardens here.
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: Did you want to talk a little bit about that?
Graham: I think it’s wonderful we have a community garden, quite close to the
Heritage Museum here in Encinitas. And there are people who live in condominiums
00:44:00or apartments and they don’t have a yard to put a garden. So, community garden
gives them wonderful opportunity.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: Um, now, I do want to encourage people, even if they don’t have a yard,
to consider possibly growing—we used to call it pot culture, but now that gives
you the wrong impression--container gardening! (laughs)
Karasik: Right.
Graham: Yes. For instance, you can grow a nice return of blackberries, pick the
thornless varieties in a fifteen-gallon pot, fifteen-gallon black plastic pot.
Or you can put a more decorative pot if you’d like and make it more decorative,
and you can put it on your balcony perhaps on your condominium or apartment.
Mind that you give it full sun, etc. But, even without having a yard, there are
some edibles you can grow if you research things carefully.
Karasik: Mm-hmm. Have you found that people in your neighborhood come to you and
ask you for your advice? Or how do you--(both she and Graham chuckle)
00:45:00I think I’m going to be asking you for some advice, for sure.
Graham: Well, this was an interesting first four months in the year 2022. I
captured six gophers. Now only one of them in my yard. I’m grateful for it was
only one in my yard. But the other five were in three different neighbors’
yards. And I was labeled the gopher getter. I’ve captured gophers in other yards
previous years too, but this was an especially active first four months of the
year, for some reason.
Karasik: Do you think—and I might even have heard somewhere--do you think that
the drought had a lot to do with that, that they might even be seeking water or
food, or are–are they--maybe they’ve increased their offspring. Do we know why?
Graham: I don’t think so. I didn’t hear anything connecting those variables.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: It was just a--
Karasik: And then where do you take ‘em? When you catch them.
Graham: Well, there are no have-a-heart traps for gophers. You realize this
is–(makes a gesture with her right hand of cutting off her head and lets out a
scraping sound) these are kill traps.
Karasik: Oh.
Graham: Because the gopher is not a
00:46:00wanted critter to release in a wild area. No. So, the traps you’d use are kill
traps for gophers.
Karasik: Hmm. Unfortunate, but necessary.
Graham: Mm-hmm. Because remember if you don’t deal with it early, the pest note
that University of California Cooperative Extension puts out on gophers, I
believe it says, “In irrigated areas, like our gardens, gophers can have up to
three litters a year.” And I believe they said the number in the litter can vary
from like five to seven. So, that’s a pretty horrific number of offspring they
could produce in a year, if you don’t deal with them quickly.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And I think it was this year I was given the gopher getter title,
because the one party I trapped a gopher successfully was just put the trap in
one day and the next day I had it. And she happened to comment to her neighbor
across the street, and he had a gopher, so he contacted
00:47:00me. And there were these three neighbors fairly close to each other on an
adjacent street, that--
Karasik: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Graham: And the first four months of the year that--bing–bing–bing.
Karasik: Hmm. Um, going back to--you’ve mentioned a couple of times. So it’s
U.C. California San Diego, because when I tried to contact you, there is a
division there. Do you want to tell us a little bit how that’s set up, ‘cuz I
know you’re kind of under their umbrella. And--
Graham: Well, the Master Gardener program is a volunteer branch of the
University of California Cooperative Extension. It’s not just one university,
‘cuz sometimes people have thought, “Oh, you’re office is at U.C.S.D.” No, no,
it’s actually in the County Operations Center in Corina Mesa.
Karasik: Mmm.
Graham: And we have information that is generated from all of these universities
throughout the state. Now some of it applies directly to where we’re here in the
San Diego.
00:48:00Another applies to more northern California areas. But the information clearly
tells you that. And of course, our tax money is paying for some of this
research, because we have a very productive agricultural economy in California.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And the research is directed toward the agricultural, commercial aspect.
But there are spinoff bits of information that are generated that directly help
the home gardener as well. So we’re out there. As a matter of fact, if I can
bend your ear, the story about the creation of the Master Gardener program was
apparently it started in Washington state. And this good-hearted cooperative
extension agent was getting a lot of calls, people having questions on their
home garden situation. But he was being paid to advise and help out the
commercial growers and farmers. And he didn’t want to be rude and not help them, but
00:49:00he had his plate full helping the commercial farmers. So he got the brilliant
idea. I’ll train a crew of volunteers and when I get a home garden question I
will pass the question on to them. And that’s what I was told started the Master
Gardener program. And now I’ve been told that we actually have Master Gardeners
in all fifty states.
Karasik: Oh, wow, good.
Graham: So--
Karasik: Oh, that’s great. Well, um, we’ve certainly had an interesting
conversation here and if there’s anything else that you would like to tell.
We’re so appreciative of the work that you’ve done and I can see where that’s
been a really big part of your life and I’ve–I’m assuming very rewarding--
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: --and it’s enabled you to make a lot of friends and--
Graham: And I’d like to say also I’m very pleased to volunteer for the Solana
Center for Environmental Innovation.
Karasik: Oh, that’s such a great place.
00:50:00
Graham: Right here in Encinitas.
Karasik: Let’s talk about that just for a little bit, because again in the
future I think that will be something that will still be here.
Graham: Yes, of course.
Karasik: And they do so many things there. Let’s talk about that a little bit.
Graham: Well, they were at the Encinitas EcoFest, right next to my Master
Gardener exhibit. And they teach many aspects and as far as gardening,
composting, very important. And instead of having that truck rumble through your
neighborhood once a week and pick up the green waste in the bin, if more of us
could compost on site, it would help the environment. Also, of course, if you’ve
ever gone to the nursery and priced bags of potting soil and compost, it’s not
inexpensive if you consider the number of bags you could use as an avid gardener
for the year.
Karasik: And I don’t know if we always know where all that soil came from.
Graham: Well, it is nice to have control of it from your own garden and know
what went into it exactly.
Karasik: Exactly.
Graham: And while it does take a little bit of room
00:51:00and it does take some time, it also is a nice excuse to get out into the fresh
air in the garden.
Karasik: What do you recommend, because I know a lot of people are afraid to
compost because they think it will bring critters?
Graham: Oh, okay. When you are putting certain elements in the compost pile that
you think might accidentally bring critters like the egg shell, or the citrus
peel or the avocado pits or something, it is highly recommended that you bury
that in the compost pile with a layer at least four inches maybe even six inches
of yard trimmings above it. That will basically absorb any odors and of course
it’s not recommended that you put bones in the compost pile, because that would
tend to attract critters.
Karasik: Mm-hmm. Now, will–will worms come into that? Or is a worm compost kind
of a separate approach to composting?
Graham: Well there is vermicompost
00:52:00in a worm bin.
Karasik: Right.
Graham: Worms will come into your compost pile.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And you give them things to eat.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: The fruit waste, like the peels and pits, etc. As well as the
decomposing leaves and twigs, etc.
Karasik: Leftover food, and lettu—greens, things like that.
Graham: Vegetables and fruits leftover.
Karasik: Yeah. Yeah.
Graham: Not meat. Of course.
Karasik: Right, right.
Graham: Not meat or bugs.
Karasik: Yeah.
Graham: And of course, you’ve moistened the environment in the compost pile to
help it decompose and they–worms breathe through their skin and they need a
moist–yep, they actually need a moist skin to survive. So, they are very happy
to find this moist environment which offers them perfect lodging and food
buffet, moisture, yes.
Karasik: Just for my own curiosity. I’ve always been fascinated by earthworms
and the fact that you’ve–that you’ve–they’re w–w–one of the few living beings
where you can cut off their head and they’ll grow another one. Is that correct?
Graham: No. that’s not--
Karasik: They’ll grow, maybe not their head, but the back
00:53:00end or--
Graham: No.
Karasik: That’s not true?
Graham: Um, too many people--I mean, depending on the amount you cut off at the
tail end, they might survive.
Karasik: Not intentionally, obviously.
Graham: Yeah. But if you accidentally cut one in two, some people have this
misconception that you’ll get two worms. No. It’ll die.
Karasik: Aw. I had that misconception.
Graham: Yeah. That’s a popular--
Karasik: And they are so critical.
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: They are so critical. But probably one of the most or when we look
at–at soil. Are you familiar with soil regeneration and some of the ways that
they’re trying now to--because so much of our soil has been depleted? Do you get
involved in that, or are you just--
Graham: Well, with the compost pile, you’re helping replenish.
Karasik: mm-hmm.
Graham: And when you think about it, okay. The nutrients it takes for let’s say
your peach tree to make peaches, it has to make leaves. Well, some of that is
from the very leaves that came,
00:54:00matured, off the tree. So, you’re recycling it in the compost pile and putting
it back underneath the tree when you’re putting some compost into the soil under
your peach tree.
Karasik: Right. Wonderful. That’s–that’s a good point as well.
Graham: Mm-hmm.
Karasik: Yeah.
Graham: So you’re just basically recycling the nutrients as opposed to chucking
them into the trash and hauling them off to the land fill.
Karasik: Yeah.
Graham: And not even chucking them into the green bin and having them hauled
off. But, at least when it goes to the green facility at Miramar, it gets
repurposed. But it’s more.
Karasik: Have you ever visited that place?
Graham: Oh yes! It was fantastic. This was decades ago.
Karasik: That would be a wonderful tour.
Graham: There was a field trip--I don’t remember if it was Master Gardeners or
the Encin--the Solana Center sponsored the field trip decades ago. It was so
much fun! And wow, it was interesting.
Karasik: I’d like to do that. I’d also like to visit one of these desalination
plants and see how they’re doing that.
Graham: Oh, yes.
Karasik: Because that seems to be the future. Now, that’s another point.
00:55:00
Graham: I was able to take a tour of that too. That was Solana Center that
hosted that decades ago.
Karasik: Oh, did they?
Graham: From up the street at the Carlsbad Desalinization Plant.
Karasik: Yes! I might ask them if they know how somebody can do that now. One
other thing I wanted to ask about the Solana Center. I had seen something where
you can get some buckets and take it home, and so you can kind of get compost
from them, or maybe a starter? How does that work?
Graham: Um, you pay a fee. I—don’t quote me because I’m not sure exactly how
much it is. You get a bucket to take home, and you put your fruit and vegetable
waste in it, and also bones and—in other words, if you’re not composting you put
these materials in there.
Karasik: Mm-hmm.
Graham: And it has some bokashi in it, which ferments it.
Karasik: Is bokashi an organism that breaks it down?
Graham: It’s a--
Karasik: What is that?
Graham: --it’s more like a chemical--
Karasik: Oh, okay.
Graham: --that pickles it. I think it’s what they
00:56:00compare it to.
Karasik: Okay.
Graham: And you can take that back, and then you can get some finished compost
as well. So--
Karasik: Oh, that’s how--
Graham: --but you’ll–you’ll want to call the Solana Center and ask for the details.
Karasik: Right. Yes. I’ve been over there and they were very supportive to us--
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: --for the EcoFest as well.
Graham: Yes.
Karasik: Well, I just want to thank you for your time. And this has been a
really interesting and educational interview. And you have definitely had a
wonderful life, and I sense the fact that you will be around for quite a while
and helping a whole lot more people. And I’m so happy to know you and really
appreciate your time, and what you’re going to offer for future generations.
Graham: Well, thanks for this opportunity to reach out to people.
Karasik: Oh, absolutely. You’re so welcome. So again we’re--actually, I don’t
know if I mentioned this. We’re at the San Dieguito Heritage Museum which is
here in Encinitas and I really wish that people could see that, although they’ll
have the opportunity to do that, you know, locally.
00:57:00But the history here at this particular museum is incredible, as well. So, would
encourage people to come out if they happen to listen to this and we thank them
also for the opportunity to use their equipment, and hope that this will be a
good video. So, thank you very much.
Graham: You’re very welcome.
Karasik: And we will finish here.
GLOSSARY
Babcock peach (pg. 15)
Biophaline (pg. 7, 8)
California Rare Fruit Growers (pg. 18-19)
Carlsbad Desalinization Plant (pg. 24)
County Operations Center [Corina Mesa] (pg. 20)
EcoFest (pg.1, 6, 10, 14, 21, 25)
Glyphosate (pg.6)
Heritage Museum (pg. 19)
Integrated Pest Management (pg.3, 4)
Johns Hopkins University (pg. 11)
Kirkcaldy, Scotland (pg. 12)
Lockheed Marine Biology Research facility (pg. 10, 14)
Master Gardener(s) (pg. 1-4, 6, 12-15, 17, 20-21, 24)
Panamint nectarine (pg. 15)
Polychaete (pg. 7, 8)
San Dieguito Heritage Museum (pg. 25)
San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station [Plant One] (pg. 7, 8, 10, 12)
Solana Center for Environmental Innovation (pg. 21, 24-25)
Stone, Harry (pg. 18)
Sunset Western Garden book (pg. 13, 17)
Sunshine Gardens Nursery (pg. 19)
Truck farm (pg. 19)
University of California Cooperative Extension (pg. 12, 20, 21)
Vermicompost (pg. 22)
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